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D6 Fantasy (Dungeons & D6) Converting Monsters from D&D to D6 Fantasy

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Perhaps posting what rankles you with the undead, and what you have tried and why you think they don't have a "fair shake", then maybe some of us can offer suggestions you may not have considered.

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Phoneposting so it'll be short, but undead in most source material have immunities to most physical damage unless it's energy like fire or electric, with magic or silver weapons bypassing said immunities. I can see a zombie accumulating wound levels for example, upto it being dismembered enough to be incap functionally, though I lean toward it not suffering dice penalties from such....then things like wraiths or banshees I get sort of stuck on , I can't imagine them being anything other than either fine or vanquished, making them extremely deadly in D6.

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maybe i'm once again over thinking it. someone irl just pointed out that i'm stuck in the d&d mindset regarding incorporeal undead and that such creatures in different videogames perhaps offer a solution; for example incorporeal undead appear in skyrim and can be hurt with normal weapons w/o too much breaking of immersion (they are less "not physically there" and more physically made of cold generating soul sucking ectoplasm)

- or in the guantlet remake, incorporeal undead appear, swirl around making straffing runs where they try to dive through you and "poof out" if struck only to return over and over every 15-30 seconds until the pile of bones from which they spawn is destroyed.

Perhaps such creatures are the one case where using hit points/body points rather than wound levels are would be preferred. 

But setting that problem aside, what about undead that "drain" in some fashion? how would we best translate that into d6 fantasy? a vampire that grapples you drains what exactly and how much? 1D pips? a whole die? same question for wraiths or specters or what have you...do they drain anything or just try to strangle you, or claw with necrosis inducing results? are almost all answers here valid? and might it be that no two such critters would be alike mechanically?

incorporeal undead could just do normal damage alone leaving frostbite type wounds or necrotic type wounds, or they could drain attributes, and if they drain, does the loss return over time via normal healing or does it require a priest or a quest or the final true destruction of the monster or...is it irreversible?  a lot of ways one could go and it may be that my first impulse to nail it all down in a uniform universal van ritchens / van helsing type guide of repeatable consistency is a mistake?

i'm dying (losing attribute dice in fact) to hear the input of others on the matter.

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10 hours ago, slipshot762 said:

i'm dying (losing attribute dice in fact) to hear the input of others on the matter.

I'll mention what I've done, not knowing for certain if you have something like that in your game, but perhaps you can use the idea in theory.

Instead of having "life drain" in that it removes skills or attributes, I have done where it "adds Fatigue".  I used the Fatigue aspect as a way to make it so people didn't just fight their way through everything all of the time, or sleep in their armor.  Each point of Fatigue reduced from their die rolls for ALL skills and attributes (except resistance rolls to limit damage).  So 1 Fatigue is a mild annoyance.  They just minus 1 from the total each time they make a skill or attribute check.  But once you start adding up the Fatigue to 2, 3, 4 or more, they start REALLY noticing the effect when it's on every die roll.  

So with that said, I would have an undead like a Wraith inflict something like 3 Fatigue each time they successfully hit a living being.  Or if 3 is too much, make it an even 2. 

Why not make it based on quality of hit?  Because of the effect of Fatigue and the slow rate of recovery from it.  (Need extra sleep above 8 hours for 2 consecutive sleep cycles to recover 1 Fatigue.  Each consecutive day after the 2nd with extra sleep will recover 1 more Fatigue.  If a person doesn't get more than 8 hours sleep on consecutive sleep cycles, the requirement of 2 consecutive sleep cycles starts over.

It won't take too long before a character's Fatigue makes them so completely worthless that they flee in terror.  "What do you mean I have to minus 12 from my rolls?"

 

But you can also vary the effect of certain undead.  Something like a zombie or ghoul could just do claw/bite attacks, but with the added effect of the character needing a Stamina roll of Moderate (for a scratch) or Very Difficult (for a bite) to avoid being infected with a disease that provides an ever-increasing -1D to their Strength/Constitution (whatever you might use) every 30 minutes or 1 hour, and when the penalty exceeds their attribute, they pass out and may go into a coma until healed or dead.

Or you could have, as you mentioned, a "cold touch of death" effect on the target, in addition to the damage inflicted in the attack.  The "cold touch" pierces to their soul, so to speak, and counts as one point of "death" upon the character.  When the points of "death"...an ever-increasing coldness in their body, even if it is sunny and warm out...  reach 3 they lose 1D from EACH attribute.  When they reach 6, they another 1D, and so on every 3 points of "death".  When an attribute like Strength/Constitution or Intelligence reaches 0 or lower, the character dies.  They can eliminate the "cold touch of death" on them by defeating the undead that inflicted it upon them, or by going to a holy site and resting there under the care of a priest.  Each 6 hours of rest and care on a holy site will remove 1 "death" touch.  

And certain things could provide protection against these attacks.  Perhaps a holy relic/charm may either increase their resistance against undead attacks, making it harder for the undead to actually inflict an attack that could spread disease/increase fatigue/deal the cold touch of death.  Or perhaps a blessed item could cause additional harm to an undead, or maybe it could resist a certain amount of evil taint...say by negating the first 1 or 2 or 3 instances of the undead's special attack.

 

Another thing you could do is make it so that things like Ghosts could attack by choking or squeezing a person, ignoring the character's armor and ability to "dodge", since it is a relatively unseen attack.  Of course, if the character's could do something to make the ghost visible (smoke, dust, whatever)  they could strike at it, but with an added difficulty to hit (say +3D for a mostly incorporeal ghost, or +1D for a mostly visible...without assistance...ghost that can be seen relatively easily by is still a less than corporeal being).  

 

I would suggest deciding upon each type of undead creature to see if certain things are more beneficial.  Perhaps silver works particularly well on ghouls, but is just like any other weapon against zombies.  And vampires might be more harmed by piercing WOOD weapons rather than anything made of steel.  Perhaps steel only does 1/4 damage or 1/2 damage to a vampire, but a wood piercing weapon does triple damage.  All other weapons would do normal damage.  But you could also add enhanced regeneration for damage done by non-specialized attacks.  I always use an old movie I saw called "Monster Squad" as a basis for this.  They blew Wolfman up with dynamite.  Litterally blew him to tiny pieces and bloody chunks.  But the pieces magically merged back together over time and the wolfman came back to life after a while, because the attack wasn't done with silver.  But the silver bullet later completely killed the wolfman when he was shot in the chest.  The damage was enough it would kill a person anyway, but this time, wolfman stayed dead because it was with the item that made the damage "real" and not able to be magically resisted.  Ghosts could be seriously injured by something as simple as holy water  tosses in their direction.  The tiny water particles would be like acid to a ghost.  Or maybe smoke from a burning censer would cause ghosts to be kept away, and stop certain undead from coming into it (like a wraith) but mean absolutely nothing to a vampire or ghoul.

 

Hopefully this gives you some ideas.

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10 hours ago, Grimace said:

Hopefully this gives you some ideas.

It does indeed! Thank you!

I checked out a word doc version of the buffy the vampire slayer D6 iteration to see how undead were handled there, too. I'm beginning to shy away from a uniform "monster manual" approach as taken in d&d, where a monster of a given type is the same in general with known pre-packaged abilities and weaknesses, and leaning toward making it vary by creature and adventure, otherwise the flexibility of D6 is lost; or at least not utilized to its fullest potential. it's funny how once players get a good grip on D6 simply nothing else will do, anything else is too limiting. amazing in truth.

so long as everyone knows that:

1) to be touched by undead will have extranormal negative results such as fatigue or drain

2) silver, magic, religous items/influence or spending fate point per attack is required in the short term

3) negative effects may require intervention of priests/temples or quests to mitigate or remove

4) many such creatures can be defeated short term with above methods, but long term defeat may require methods to break the curse that created them.

This would prevent players from memorizing a laundry list of "right moves" vs assorted undead, instead, they'd have a short list of things generally known to be useful against most "spirits" or "devils of the flesh", reviving the fear horror and mystery such creatures used to evoke before everyone read the monster manual and became cold blooded professionals. It would keep them on their toes and "honest", as it were.

Thanks again, your input has helped greatly with the creative block i've had with this matter, and i've also recently surpassed another with regard to a possible conversion of the fuedal lord simulator that was the birthright setting; where counties/territories had a stat for material/magic capacity listed like (6/2); in D6 i'd simply convert those to dice and treat it the way the "funds" attribute was treated.

Thus a player with lands would allocate these material or magic "funds" dice in a month to different projects to achieve their fuedal desires; raising troops or increasing trade or filling the forest with gargoyles or whatever. Think of the Stronghold series of video games were you have to assign workers to a wide range of projects to make the food and supplies needed to build walls and raise armies and such.

Still going to nail down something similar for mass combat too, both tactical where units of 50-100 troops of similar kit become single entities and manuever and opposed roll (draw heavily from D6 star wars capitol ship combat for this I think) and strategic level, though I think at the strategic level opposed command rolls would give me the gist of an invasions outcome.

So maybe an invasion would begin with opposed command rolls for a general outcome, a tactical level battle using groups of archer/infantry/cavalry similar to a SW-D6 capship battle, and a small adventure for players within that tactical setting similar to the scene/encounter/round break down in star wars where they have at least some influence on the large scale outcome.

While sorting these things out i'm also trying to decide the type of campaign setting i want and that i think my players will like, which is hard in terms of balancing everyones expectations with my own, but I think I'm nearly there. I'd love to share my thoughts on that but this IS a creature conversion thread and I do not want to derail it too badly, I'll try to limit further contribution here to statting critters and maybe make a different thread or add to an existing one whose subject is world building or similar, I believe theres one of yours, Grimace, discussing your years of homebrew for D6 from before the release of D6 Fantasy, I may dump my jumbled thoughts there when next I get time.

As of now, though, I'm thinking creature conversions are best done on an individual adventure basis, the zombies of the black temple may be very different from the cannibal corpses of dark-light tower for example. Thanks again gentlefolk!

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I'll be interested to hear what you come up with for the mass combat.  I've attempted, but never really came up with anything that I liked.

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