Zero G Assault Troopers / Space Troopers

[TinMan]

Has anyone ever used these guys in a game? I'm thinking of including an adventure where my guys have to deal with these bad guys.

The thing is I'm thinking they are kind of underpowered to be much use.

They:

Only have a silly little 3D Starfighter scale torch to cut through hulls and these guys were used to go after Cap ships in the Thrawn Trilogy?

Are listed as Character scale, I think the suits should at least be Speeder scale and the suit should be rolled separately from the troopers own strength not added to it. The suit is essentially a mini ship.

Also they don't have anything that negates ships shields, yet they are meant to get up close and personal with ships. I think that would be a bit hard if the shields (particle) are still intact.

I want to use them but I am considering changing a couple of things and giving them a couple of toys to make what they are built to do a bit more possible game mechanics wise.

[Cryonic]

They can't destroy a capital class ship with that torch, so there is no reason for the torch to do capital scale damage. The suit adds to their own strength as the trooper is wrapped up by the suit (e.g. his arms and legs are in the suits arms and legs for movement and such).

Shields in SW D6 were for stopping rays only (the hull value already included what was considered particle shielding). So a trooper could just pass right through them to the hull of a ship.

[TinMan]

They can't destroy a capital class ship with that torch, so there is no reason for the torch to do capital scale damage. The suit adds to their own strength as the trooper is wrapped up by the suit (e.g. his arms and legs are in the suits arms and legs for movement and such).

Shields in SW D6 were for stopping rays only (the hull value already included what was considered particle shielding). So a trooper could just pass right through them to the hull of a ship.

The torch or the trooper is suposed to be able to cut his way into a cap scale ship so he can board it. So I still don't see why the torch is weak.

Shield wise even if the trooper can pass through the shields he still isn't going to scratch most Star Fighter scale hulls wth a crappy 3D torch.

As the trooper stats sit now they are pretty useless as far as their intended purpose of boarding actions go.

If I put them up against my guys (on a Stock light frieghter sized vessel) even with the element of surprise they aren't going to do much more than turn then turn themselves into pigs for the slaughter. My guys will have a ton of fun just picking them off.

Give them speeder scale suit strength, proper 9D plasma torches and then we may have a challenge, until then they are a joke.

[Cryonic]

The torch or the trooper is supposed to be able to cut his way into a cap scale ship so he can board it. So I still don't see why the torch is weak. Right, but he isn't able to actually destroy the ship. Think back to the scene from the first movie. How much damage do you think the Blockade Runner really suffered when the troopers blew open her airlock after cutting through? Try ZERO. You don't need Capital Scale weapons to take down a door on a capital ship.


Shield wise even if the trooper can pass through the shields he still isn't going to scratch most Star Fighter scale hulls wth a crappy 3D torch.

That's because a torch isn't for doing lots of damage in a short period of time. It is for taking something apart methodically. Think of someone cutting through a safe and you get the idea of the torch.


As the trooper stats sit now they are pretty useless as far as their intended purpose of boarding actions go.

If I put them up against my guys (on a Stock light freighter sized vessel) even with the element of surprise they aren't going to do much more than turn themselves into pigs for the slaughter. My guys will have a ton of fun just picking them off.

Give them speeder scale suit strength, proper 9D plasma torches and then we may have a challenge, until then they are a joke.

[Jamfke]

Well, they might not do much against the Millennium Falcon with its 6D hull, but a standard stock light freighter only has 4D, so that torch could do quite a bit of damage. Another fave, the Ghtroc 720 only has 3D+2. Remember, SLFs are starfighter scale. Of course, you could also default to the material the ship is constructed of. A blast door, for instance, is listed in the core rules as having a strength code of 6D, and unless I'm mistaken, that's at character scale. Scaling from starfighter to character gives you 6D, added to the torch's base damage, it now does 9D to the blast door.

Also, since the troopers aren't mindless androids, they would attack a vessel at its weakest points, such as airlocks, boarding ramps, maintenance hatches, etc. Areas with the heaviest armor plating would be avoided for the most part.

[TinMan]

I was chatting with Rerun and he said the same thing against the airlocks it would be the best place for them to go. I never thought the torch could or was meant to destroy a ship.
I was basing my thoughts on how the plasma torch boarding device will do 9D starfighter scale damage which is enough to cut straight through the hulls of many cap ships. So I thought the troopers should have something similar IF they are planning on cutting right through the hull at any point they wish.

If the troopers focus on the airlocks then that 3D Starfighter scale torch would make more sense, I just wish they had included ideas like that in the book.

Making the the suit speeder scale and a seperate role still may be an idea since I'm not sold on the suit/mini space ship just addings it's hull code to the troopers existing strength. I don't know, I'm on the fence on that last point.

[Jamfke]

I'm thinking that the armor's add to the trooper's Str was written up that way for personal combat purposes. I'm sure the designers figured that the Z-G troops would be fought face to face. Against an X-Wing, the trooper's 6D Str code would be swallowed up by the fighter's scaled up 12D damage-if they can hit them. The pilot of an X-Wing would take a -6D mod to their attack roll just to hit one of these guys. That's another reason for the character scale of the suit, I'm sure.

EDIT: Sorry, that 6D is added to the trooper's Dodge roll, not to the attacker's attack roll. (That's a 9D for Dodge!)

[asmkm22]

We used those and Rad Troopers pretty often in our games for some reason. As far as boarding was concerned, I think the GM was winging it anyway, for cinematic value. Torches only came into play when used against characters for the most part.

[Jamfke]

We used those and Rad Troopers pretty often in our games for some reason. As far as boarding was concerned, I think the GM was winging it anyway, for cinematic value. Torches only came into play when used against characters for the most part.

OUCH! That'd leave a mark!

[Cryonic]

Well, they might not do much against the Millennium Falcon with its 6D hull

Even though they are listed as only 3D damage, they should cut through the Falcon's hull just fine. The torch won't do any appreciable damage to the ship itself, but you don't need to do appreciable damage to cut a line through the plate. Think of it more like "damage" that builds up over time to the specific spot. Hit the hull for a second and you won't even score the paint, but hold it there for a minute or more...

[asmkm22]

Even though they are listed as only 3D damage, they should cut through the Falcon's hull just fine. The torch won't do any appreciable damage to the ship itself, but you don't need to do appreciable damage to cut a line through the plate. Think of it more like "damage" that builds up over time to the specific spot. Hit the hull for a second and you won't even score the paint, but hold it there for a minute or more...

That's pretty much why we never bothered with Hull damage in those scenarios. I vaguely remember the GM using some kind of algorithm to convert a torch damage roll into time it took to open a hole, but I don't recall the specifics.

[Jamfke]

Yeah, really, that's what should be addressed for a cutting torch, how many rounds will it take to get through. That would be something interesting for someone to list here.

Looking at the fusion cutter in Galladnium's Fantastic Technology, it states in its description that it can cut through most metals, plastics, and ceramics of up to 25 cm thickness within seconds. You could calculate how quickly it would take to slice a hatch open based on that I suppose.

[Grimace]

:confused:Whaaa?!!! Zero G troopers being described as weenie??!:eek:

I'm not sure how a suit of armor capable of going into space, moving at a space speed of 1, adding +4D vs Physical and +3D vs Energy is considered weenie. Add in that 3D laser cutters (note the plural) in Starfighter scale are going to be going up against airlocks that sit somewhere around 6D-8D Character scale for resistance. These guys can punch a hole in the airlock, vacate the atmosphere, and still be operating at full potential. Is the crew going to be performing the same? Doubt it.

But then lets get to the weapons. A blaster cannon doing 6D damage. A grenade launcher that can fire either concussion grenades or gas/stun grenades out to 200 meters. Chances of having that sort of straight line distance inside a ship is pretty darn small, so everything is going to be short range for them. Finally, don't forget their mini-proton missiles! Those will really mess up your day.

Wow...saying Zero G troopers are puny is like saying taking out a fully equipped Imperial Garrison is like a stroll in the park.

[TinMan]

:confused:Whaaa?!!! Zero G troopers being described as weenie??!:eek:

I'm not sure how a suit of armor capable of going into space, moving at a space speed of 1, adding +4D vs Physical and +3D vs Energy is considered weenie. Add in that 3D laser cutters (note the plural) in Starfighter scale are going to be going up against airlocks that sit somewhere around 6D-8D Character scale for resistance. These guys can punch a hole in the airlock, vacate the atmosphere, and still be operating at full potential. Is the crew going to be performing the same? Doubt it.

But then lets get to the weapons. A blaster cannon doing 6D damage. A grenade launcher that can fire either concussion grenades or gas/stun grenades out to 200 meters. Chances of having that sort of straight line distance inside a ship is pretty darn small, so everything is going to be short range for them. Finally, don't forget their mini-proton missiles! Those will really mess up your day.

Wow...saying Zero G troopers are puny is like saying taking out a fully equipped Imperial Garrison is like a stroll in the park.

After talking it out with a few people on here I have gained more respect for them. At first glance however they don't look like they would be much of a challenge when up against a freighter full of PC's with half a brain. Now that we have determined that they would go after the airlocks and not try and cut straight through a hull (like a plasma torch boarding device does) they make more sense. Still the target ship needs to either be totally immobile or at station keeping and unaware of the attack for the troopers to be effective. The other more direct tactic is the trooper’s assault shuttle ploughing in and beating the ship into submission before the Zero G guys can have at it.

The only other problem I can see for the troopers is their size. At 2 meters tall only one could fit in the airlock and the ships hallways at a time, so IF you can take out the lead guy he will plug up the way for the troopers behind him.

Plus
Just dumping them into a space battle would be utter suicide for them; obviously they were never intended for that.

In anycase now that I have a beter understanding of how to use them, one of my games will include an assault by a full platoon of these guys :-)

[Whill]

Yeah with that armored powersuit I always thought they were bad-@ss myself.