Metaphysics and other Extranormal Attributes

[Paragon]

I'm a little unclear on something, and thought perhaps someone could enlighten me.

As far as I can tell, the only function Extranormal attributes like Metaphysics do is operate as a base for the various skills associated with it. The cost to increase the attribute is is 10x the current die code. The cost to increase the Extranormal skills is 2x current die code.

My question is, then, why would anyone increase the attribute for most of these? I haven't looked at all of them but Metaphysics only has three skills, and as I recall, Magic only has four. It would seem like its always more cost effective to increase just the skills. In particular, when acquiring such abilities after play, it seems like you'd just chuck the first die into it and never touch the actual attribute again.

Am I missing something?

[Lubidius]

Yes, most usually put a part of their starting attribute dice (or character points) into the attribute, then they likely never touch it again. In that situation, the attribute is just an indication of your initial raw magical or metaphysical ability; then you subsequently just increase each of the 4 magic skills as desired.

With that said....

IF the GM wants a more granular spell system, some (likely myself) treat each of the existing magic "skills" actually as psuedo-attributes, and then each spell in that domain or however you want to label it; is considered an individual learned "skills". In that style of magic implementation, raising the psuedo-attribute (for example Apportation) could be more globally effective, as all learned spells under that attribute would gain as opposed to only the individual spell you put character points into improving. This is 'similar' to how Star Wars 2nd Edition Revised & Expanded works.

I think the main mechanic intended in the system is that you were supposed to initially put "something" as a base into a meta attribute. To allow for some initial balance during character creation. I think the minimum is "1D" in a meta-attribute , hence, you are at least forcing the person to start off and spend creation points or D (dice) into being capable of doing magic of metaphysics.

[Lubidius]

Here is an example magic rule that does not use a base attribute. Each spell is just a distinct skill you have to learn from scratch.

http://www.northernmountains.com/hd6/aoe_rules.htm#Magic

And here is one I worked on, similar, but different...:)

http://docs.google.com/View?id=ddvhgd2q_108g2b6tfms

LONG story short, your original assessment is correct; that in most situations, from the core rules (either fantasy, adventure or space) and no house rules perspective, yes, you'd likely just add to your individual "skill" between adventures.

[harmyn]

Now what my friend and I came up with is closer to the Force Attributes from Star Wars in that you have three base skills that are required depending on the spell in question. You then improve the base magical skill (we use three times the current level like an Advanced Skill) and each time you up it a pip you might get a new spell depending on the setting or genre in question. We are testing it now, hopefully we will have something interesting to report back on it.

[Cryonic]

Actually there is always a cost break point where it is cheaper to raise the base and so raise all the skills under it. If you only put 1D into the attribute, then when the skills get to 2D, it is cheaper to pay 10 for the attribute, than 12 for the three skills for the same +1 pip.

[Paragon]

Actually there is always a cost break point where it is cheaper to raise the base and so raise all the skills under it. If you only put 1D into the attribute, then when the skills get to 2D, it is cheaper to pay 10 for the attribute, than 12 for the three skills for the same +1 pip.

That was the only thing I could think of; but it seems that gap gets larger and larger as things rise up. Of course by then you probably have a relatively high Extranormal attribute anyway.

[Kalzazz]

I kinda like using the Bloodshadows/Vade Mecum specialties as they give more flavor

[MystiColin]

I posted this on another thread (http://www.wegfansite.com/forum/showthread.php?p=20487#post20487) but I'm posting it here as well to hedge my bets...