Would you be interested in an updated version of Shatterzone?

[The Game Guy]

I am just curious to find out whether people would be interested in an updated version of shatterzone.

IE If someone really put love into it and updated it and made it one hell of a sci fi rpg.

[Stormchild]

What need be updated?

[imported_Magman]

Know nothing about the game. Sorry - couldn't vote.

[Stormchild]

Played it, liked it, but I don't know what should be updated. Any ideas?

[Kansas Jim]

As far as an update goes, I suspect the main thing would be the game mechanics rather than the setting since there's not much about the setting you still couldn't use today.

[Stormchild]

OK, then what should be done with the rules? Right now, we have rules that are nearly the same as the masterbook rules but different enough so that they are not absolutely compatible. So, how should it be done? As D6 or as Torg or built on the existing rules or changed to masterbook rules or something else? It even could be used as a nukleus for a stripped down version of D6.

[Kansas Jim]

OK, then what should be done with the rules?
I'd probably go with a fixed version of what was published, you could either go back towards Torg or forward towards Masterbook (SZ was an intermediate step between the two). Personally I'd revert back to more Torgian mechanics, but the grittier, less heroic nature of Masterbook might be a better fit for SZ.

But that would be for myself, if I decided to run a SZ game. If I were a publisher looking to relaunch it in the marketplace I would want to adapt it to whatever my company's house system was going to be, be it a Torg 2.0, some flavor of D6 or whatever.

[asmkm22]

As far as an update goes, I suspect the main thing would be the game mechanics rather than the setting since there's not much about the setting you still couldn't use today.

Update the art and writing styles, IMO. Those two can go a long way to selling an old product to a new audience.

[SDF_II]

I'd agree with the update. There were things that needed worked out a little better. I'd be up for it.

Mechanic wise I'd polish off the Adv/Comp. I liked the way SZ did this, alot better than MB IMHO. I like the way the Skill-Based Combat works in TORG, and I would include that in the update. I would also expand and explain Psionics a little more.

The setting/universe just needs better books. A complete map of the universe, something like Alternity had. A better Corporation book. Obviously some more sector books, and of course a Zone book.

*ponder* Of course, like any other game system, I'd like to see this stuff on the web. I think a mapping (space, world, city, etc) mapping program which can be used by the GM would rock.

[hellsreach]

As far as setting, I think it has a little too much of the 80's-90's dark gritty cyberpunk genre that could definately be updated to a more cinematic transhumanist vibe. Of course, ways that I would go about that would give is a sort of Septimus influence which I would want to avoid for fear of stepping on toes.

[skeloric]

If it were updated to be part of TORG, I'd be in line to get it.
I never had the game, only read a few novels and that was years after the game was gone.
I REALLY wanted to see how Eric would have presented it.
Essentially I'm in the "DEPENDS" camp.

[The Game Guy]

As far as setting, I think it has a little too much of the 80's-90's dark gritty cyberpunk genre that could definately be updated to a more cinematic transhumanist vibe. Of course, ways that I would go about that would give is a sort of Septimus influence which I would want to avoid for fear of stepping on toes.

Well, of course the setting would have to be updated since it's a 10 year old setting.

I guess you have no Shatterzone stuff left at all in the warehouse?

[The Game Guy]

If it were updated to be part of TORG, I'd be in line to get it.
I never had the game, only read a few novels and that was years after the game was gone.
I REALLY wanted to see how Eric would have presented it.
Essentially I'm in the "DEPENDS" camp.

Well since Eric is trying to get rid of WEG, I doubt it would be by him. It would be done by whoever buys WEG, the license or whoever else wants to do an updated version.

[skeloric]

Well since Eric is trying to get rid of WEG, I doubt it would be by him. It would be done by whoever buys WEG, the license or whoever else wants to do an updated version.
Which I knew, I was just lamenting that Eric's idea of making it "powered by TORG" will never happen.
It was that idea which has me interested in Shatterzone more so than the original RPG.

[The Game Guy]

Which I knew, I was just lamenting that Eric's idea of making it "powered by TORG" will never happen.
It was that idea which has me interested in Shatterzone more so than the original RPG.

I wonder if Shatterzone would be better if it was converted to D6 (if it ever goes OGL)?

What do you think?

[skeloric]

I wonder if Shatterzone would be better if it was converted to D6 (if it ever goes OGL)?

What do you think?
I'd be much more interested in a dual-stat book.
Both TORG and D6 -- in less than 10 minutes I can convert any TORG book to D6 and probably convert most D6 stuff to TORG in about 4 times that -- but only because I'd have to decide on Axioms and World Laws.

TORG and D6 already share some very basic math and as such are interchangeable, dual stats would just drive that point home even better.

TORG stat of 12 is divided by 3 to be 4d.
TORG stat of 13 is divided by 3 with the 1 carried to represent the "pip" to be 4d+1

If it was presented in the book instead of forcing people to do the math, this would give the books a double purpose.

Still, I'm certain the new owner will have their own ideas but this seems such a simple thing to strengthen each line with help from the other.

[The Game Guy]

Still, I'm certain the new owner will have their own ideas but this seems such a simple thing to strengthen each line with help from the other.

Well that would depend on the new owner even considered it a game worth updating and revising.

Personally, I think Eric should have considered updating it and releasing it, maybe using D6 so he would have a setting using the new D6 system that he could have used to introduce D6 to the world (or at least a larger group of people).

Oh well

[skeloric]

Let's not forget, there is a certain amount of "Star Wars" flavoring in what I've seen of Shatterzone.

Despite it being a bit more "hard" Sci-Fi than "Epic Sci-Fantasy" like Star Wars, there is an oppressive "Imperial" group in each with Shatterzone's Fleet mimicking the Imperial presence and objectives enough to be deemable as a replacement concept.

[Stormchild]

Most of all, flavour is very different. Star Wars is fantasy in space, though the stories are often grim, it remains light-hearted. A friend who is a Star Wars fan even calls it a fairy tale in space. Shatterzone on the other hand is Cyberpunk in Space, hard, dirty, grim, the PCs know from the start that they will stand no chance against the forces that are.

[imported_Magman]

Been hearing people talk about how good shatterzone is/was for a while now. Was is really that enticing ?

[Stormchild]

It is a straight SF setting, grimmer than most and with enough possibilities for adventures to justify it. Back when it was published it unique to combine the then very popular cyberpunk genre with hard SF. But it is not unique enough to make it a success. I GMed and played it some time but my gaming group is not that interested in it anymore. Maybe I try it on Cons in Germany where Shadowrun is still very popular. Maybe the hook Shadowrun in space without magic will catch some interest.

[Havard]

I think what the game needs is some clear focus. While the universe is big enough for a vast range of campaign types, a few of these should be polished and presented as the main campaign models for a new version of SZ.

Cyperpunk/Shadowrun in Space gives some ideas of what the game was like, but the Cyberpunk Genre has changed alot since the 80s/90s. Perhaps give some more ideas about where the universe is going, and what the PCs can do about it if anything.

And it has to be presented in a way that gives customers an impression that this is something new, not just the old setting all over again.

While Transhumanism is an interesting concept, part of what made the game appeal to me is that while it is gritty, it is not as realistic as Traveller, but rather a cinematic game in the style of Aliens or Star Ship Troopers.

Havard

[Stormchild]

I think what the game needs is some clear focus. While the universe is big enough for a vast range of campaign types, a few of these should be polished and presented as the main campaign models for a new version of SZ. Havard

Good idea. I would prefer using the already pretty good fleshed out Grimsyn Sector and expanding on it.

[The Game Guy]

I think what the game needs is some clear focus. While the universe is big enough for a vast range of campaign types, a few of these should be polished and presented as the main campaign models for a new version of SZ.

Havard

I agree with this. I think it really needs a top down overhaul, overhaul the system, update the background and go from there.

As you said the Universe is really big and allows for various campaign types and could appeal to SF fans.

[agingcow2345]

Given how much of Shatterzione was either a deliberate attempt not to be Star Wars or a series of total miscommunications between me, Rich Hawran and the actual creatives the more interesting question is what parts of SZ one would wish to save.

The novels were neat but the actual setting was severly skitz. IMO. YMMV.

Scott Palter

[skeloric]

Given how much of Shatterzione was either a deliberate attempt not to be Star Wars or a series of total miscommunications between me, Rich Hawran and the actual creatives the more interesting question is what parts of SZ one would wish to save.

The novels were neat but the actual setting was severly skitz. IMO. YMMV.

Scott Palter
:eek:
You know, you really NEED to publish your memoirs.
"Confessions of a game designer" could go one million copies easily.

[Whill]

Given how much of Shatterzione was either a deliberate attempt not to be Star Wars or a series of total miscommunications between me, Rich Hawran and the actual creatives the more interesting question is what parts of SZ one would wish to save.

The novels were neat but the actual setting was severly skitz. IMO. YMMV.

Scott Palter

Forgive my ignorance on the subject - I have no memory of ever playing or even looking at Shatterzone. But being the #1 Star Wars D6 fan, when Scott Palter talks, I listen. :cool:

Scott, does your comment mean that you intended Shatterzone being more like Star Wars but it didn't turn out that way?

[The Game Guy]

Given how much of Shatterzione was either a deliberate attempt not to be Star Wars or a series of total miscommunications between me, Rich Hawran and the actual creatives the more interesting question is what parts of SZ one would wish to save.

The novels were neat but the actual setting was severly skitz. IMO. YMMV.

Scott Palter

Well I agree that the setting is severly skitz and that is one thing that can be buttoned up. I think Shatterzone is a great game (I have a copy sittiing on my shelf right now) and I think with some focus it could be updated and could be successful.

[The Game Guy]

:eek:
You know, you really NEED to publish your memoirs.
"Confessions of a game designer" could go one million copies easily.

Well, I am sure only gamers would buy the book and to be honest, I am not sure with the every shrinking gamer pool if there are even a million gamers left anymore.